entrancelogs | [ closed ] low growling

Entry tags:

[ closed ] low growling

Who: Oliver Queen and Rip Hunter
Where: tbd
When: backdated, after this
Rating: PG-13 for Oliver
Summary: Ray is acting weird, so clearly Rip must answer for it. THE LOGIC IS FLAWLESS!
The Story:

[ looking for logic in wonderland is like looking for a needle in a haystack the size of the solar system, but still - things don't add up, and oliver requires an explanation. mr. hunter mentioned mr. palmer to him in an attempt to base a common universe and timeline, which to oliver seems to suggest that mr. palmer is meant to know who the hell he is. clearly - not the case. he's been told the way to get rid of a mirror is to make them look at their own reflection - but when mr. palmer looked at his, it seemed to do nothing.

he doesn't much care for the man, but felicity does, and while oliver will protect any person who needs him to - there is a special bond reserved to the citizens of starling city. even those who bought his company from under him and charm the woman he loves.

he changes back to civvies - even with the change of color, the suit and hood are far too likely to draw attention - and picks up his phone. ]

We need to talk. Privately. Now.

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[Really, Rip suspects there's nothing good to come when he sees just who's called him--a sentiment confirmed when Oliver demands a private conversation. His first inclination is to suggest the roof, an area that contains no mirrors and an open expanse that would allow them to see anyone approaching.

However, the thought that Oliver could quite easily throw him off said roof has Rip going for another option. Out by the gardens might be a touch more populated, but the cold weather would no doubt keep most indoors still. He bundles up--duster and gun both in place--then heads out from his room on the second floor to meet the man as demanded.]

Mr. Queen. [The greeting is offered as one approaches the other, comes close enough to be heard.]

[ oliver checks the perimeter before situating himself strategically. he doesn't love this location - not with all the flying people and robots around - but he knows there's no such thing as a perfectly secure location, and the best thing they can do to keep their conversation private is to not arouse suspicion.

his own weapons are concealed - some on his person, some within reach. his feelings for rip hunter remain complicated, but at the moment - the man is the only lead he's got. he nods at his approach. ]

Mr. Hunter. Thank you for coming. [ there, he tries, though there is a stiffness to his voice. the attempt at normalcy is for the benefit of prying ears more than for the man obliging him. he nods towards the bench; they'd seem less suspicious sitting down to have a conversation if it ends up running long than standing out in the cold. ]

Of course. [Fortunately the man hasn't attempted to summon him on a Wednesday; the lamentable truth is that, outside of those evenings (and the occasional Thursday morning after), there's little that Rip engages in that he can't abandon at a moment's notice. So go the times of quiet in Wonderland; calm between each storm that lasts perhaps just long enough to tempt one to lower their guard.

But not Oliver; Rip has little doubt the man is armed, even if he can't immediately see it. Still, he plays the part of his public persona well enough. The greeting is polite, as is the gesture to sit. With no real reason to say no, Rip does indeed take a place on the bench, crossing one leg over the other as he waits for Oliver to do the same.]

Given your urgency on the phone, I'd assume this is a matter of some importance.

[ no, not oliver. it will take more than time of peace to get him to lower his guard; so long as he's a resident of this foreign, magical land - it's not going to happen. unless, of course, it takes possession of his faculties.

oliver takes a seat besides him, and attempts to suppress the anger he's riddled with. this time, he has no reason to believe that mr. hunter lied to him - it would have been a stupid, easily discovered lie and while the impression he got of the man is unfavorable, that's a far cry from 'stupid'. which means the likelihood of wonderland being behind whatever's wrong with mr. palmer is far greater than him always having been another ray palmer whose name got thrown around in a very poorly designed attempt to garner favor from a man who has no reason to like him. ]

Something is wrong with Palmer. [ straight and to the point. ] And he looked in a mirror, nothing changed. [ so if that bit of intel is true - then he's the "real" ray palmer, not his mirror self. which means oliver is left looking for another explanation. ]

[On normal days, Rip can be said to be deliberate in his actions; there is little he does of his own volition without some measure of thought or planning behind it. Even when things don't work out as he intends, his initial approach is scripted out--and though he can indeed think on the fly when the situation calls for it, he much prefers the control that comes with logical expectations, analysis, understanding of the matters and methods at hand.

Yet not every action or word can always be accounted for; whatever guesses he might have had for what caused Oliver to summon him, certainly it had not been this. He turns his head to better look at the man when he says those simple words: something is wrong with Palmer. Whatever impressions Rip has already made, there can be no mistaking the look in his eyes for anything except what it is: concern.]

He had been sent home recently, but I wasn't aware he'd returned. [Rip frowns at that; normally Ray contacts him on such occasions. Indeed, another sign of something being amiss.] Unfortunately he's also been consistently drawn in from points further ahead in our mutual timeline--so there is only so much I might be able to tell you about anything that might have changed in our world.

[And yet Rip knows he must figure this out. Given that his last memories of home were crafted under the influence of Eobard Thawne and the Legion of Doom, it's imperative that he try.]

What happened when you encountered him?

[ as he always does, oliver files that look away in his head. it could be calculating or sincere (though his gut seems to favor sincerity. it might be wishful thinking, but he's tired. he wants an allay) but right this moment it matters a little less than the content of his speech.

no, if he factors in a future point in time it makes even less sense. ]

To start off, he didn't recognize me. [ which would have been weird even if he came from oliver's past where they never met; oliver queen is a public figure. very public figure. the queen family has dominated the headlines for a very long time.

but that wasn't the worst of it, no. he's spent very little time in mr. palmer's company, but that was long enough to learn how confident the man is, and there was none of that present in the man he met here. ]

--Suggesting an alteration of either his memory or of the timeline.

[Bloody hell. Rip leans back against the bench, his head rolled back as he looks skyward. Neither possibility is a good one by any means, although there is at least the potential for one cause to perhaps be fixed--assuming they could still access the cognitive intrusion machine that had been used to restore Rip's memories to their rightful state.

Yet it's far too early to know if that is a viable method. Not without more information, and Rip doubts that Ray merely not recognizing Oliver would be enough to warrant either this meeting nor the need to confirm that he was not in fact a mirror.]

What else?

What do you mean 'an alteration of the timeline'?

[ he understands an alteration of memory, at least on a basic level, but timeline is not a possibility he considered. if that's changed - what does it mean for everyone left behind? palmer is odd, but he's alive, it's everyone else he worries about now. ]

He wasn't himself. Conspicuously. [ because really, he doesn't know palmer that well - and still alarms were flaring in his head at every sentence uttered. he was ready to subdue the man and lock him up for further investigation, that's how unnerved he was. ]

[Fortunately, what Oliver asks is an explanation Rip has given often. He shifts once more, sitting forward, his hands held in front of him with palms apart as he begins to speak.]

History is not so fixed as you might wish to believe, Mr. Queen. It can be changed, altered by someone traveling through time to a point in the past, and affecting the events that happen.

[Something he would know if Barry Allen or the Legends had already introduced him to the concept. Yet regrettably Oliver remains from the past, and thus it falls to Rip to teach him such lessons here within Wonderland.]

When you consider that, there might well be any number of reasons why Dr. Palmer wouldn't know you. [He moves a hand to his forehead, the other dropping into his lap.] Something might have been altered in his past so his life took a different course--or yours, to the same effect. Or it could be an ancestor was affected; whichever member of Dr. Palmer's line who decided to make the voyage to America, or someone crucial to your existence who was killed before you could ever be born.

Although a difference in personality as well would suggest that the affects are to his timeline rather than yours--if that is the case. [And if so, cognitive intrusion becomes useless as a solution.] Did he say anything specific that might be used to determine if it's a change of memory or of time?

[ because that's what the people of starling city need - someone messing with the few good things to have happened to them. sure, there's a spare thought given to being able to go back and avert it all - save tommy's mom - that could change everything.

malcolm merlyn never joins the league. the queen's gambit doesn't sink. it's a mind boggling concept.

but oliver being oliver, he sees the dangers of it far more clearly: both earthquake machines go off. he doesn't make it off that island to help anyone. mass-produced mirakuru. no, he doesn't like this possibility one bit. ]

He mentioned Ivy Town instead of Starling. [ he also said 'grew up in', so he's not sure of the relevance, but he did ask where's home. really, the problem is their conversation wasn't long. there isn't much oliver could bring up to determine which of two possibilities he didn't know were possible were at play. he doesn't want to admit to rip hunter how disadvantaged he is here - but he really barely knows palmer. ]

[Congratulations, Oliver. In one set of thoughts, he's weighed out all the reasons why one must approach the matter of time with discretion and responsibility.

...Not always the Legends strongest suit, admittedly.

The mention of Ivy Town does little, however. Rip merely shakes his head.] Dr. Palmer was born in Ivy Town. He moved to Starling later on, at least in the timeline as it originally played out.

[Rip has done his research, after all. He not only needed people who wouldn't overtly affect the course of history should they be removed from the timeline, but also ones of certain characteristics and skill.]

Tell me everything that happened. All that Dr. Palmer said and did. [These bits and pieces of the conversation aren't truly helpful as they come now. Oliver likely would not realize just what details were important, but Rip well might.]

[ he's been taught by the best - slade wilson, amanda waller, maseo yamashiro - to think strategically. and five years in hell+three years back in a starling city he sees entirely differently now have taught him to approach things with a healthy dose of suspicion. ]

He didn't say much. [ oliver may have gotten scary on his ass fairly quickly. ] But his attitude was off. [ the ray palmer he met was self assured. and yes, being sent to another dimension can knock the wind out of anyone - but he wasn't scared out of his mind or angry or any reaction oliver would associate with such a transformation. no, he was almost... ] Timid. [ the smug confidence that was on full display as he admitted he got the data he was using to charm the board illegally to the board members he was very successfully charming - was missing.

it's frustrating to oliver, that he can't quite explain it. his gut is screaming at him that something is wrong, but he lacks the knowledge to pinpoint and explain exactly what. ]

[For someone so talented in obtaining information, it would seem as if Oliver truly mucked it up with his go at Ray. Certainly by Rip's estimation, there have been remarkably few times when Raymond Palmer opted to say little--although that itself gives weight to Oliver's point, he supposes. Right along with the word timid; Rip frowns at the mention, again so contrary to the man he's come to consider a friend during their time both here and at home.]

Without further detail I'm afraid there is only so much I can offer, Mr. Queen. [All the more reason for Rip to go see Ray himself. Still, even this early on he can offer the possibility of solutions--to speculate on the path they might take.]

The best possibility is that he has somehow had his memories altered; the technology to correct such a thing exists in Wonderland, thanks to Dr. Palmer himself. [And his willingness to sacrifice for the sake of someone in need of saving; the least Rip can do is make use of the device that had been utilized to restore his mind.] Assuming that he has not been pulled too farther from the future, we were engaged in a struggle with a cabal who employed such methods--and were after something capable of doing far worse.

[But Eobard himself had said the Legends prevailed; Rip frowns, recalling the bits and pieces he'd managed to gleam from those conversations so far past.]

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[ closed ] low growling

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